17 comments

• Comment Link Monday, 17 February 2014 17:41 posted by Johnny Smith

  You could also argue that dogs & children don't mix, given the presumption that canine faeces is left where it was deposited in the park. The simple answer to this bovine/human public health issue is to always pick-up or keep your dog on a lead & thus ensure you are always present when they defacate.
  Simples.
• Comment Link Monday, 17 February 2014 11:33 posted by Wendy Balkwill

  If anyone watched 'Countryfile' last night, the 16th February there was an article on cows and dogs, they do not mix. The excrement from dogs carries a bug that lives on the grass for up to six months, if cattle eat the grass they can catch a disease which is incurable, it also causes miscarriage in female cows.Isuggest that anyone interested in this topic watch the programme on IPlayer, it was about half way through.
• Comment Link Thursday, 13 February 2014 06:46 posted by Michael Fuller

  I use the park as a route to The Avenue shops and for just walking: I do not have a dog. I also visit and walk in Horsell and near Fairoaks where there is cattle and have not seen any conflict with dog walkers. I expect Horse owners and the cattle have more trouble with dogs that people have with the livestock. The big problem will be the yobs that infect the park with their litter. The safety of the cattle may be at risk if the Council and police are not capable keeping the park safe.
• Comment Link Saturday, 01 February 2014 02:03 posted by Veda

  I am a Sunbury resident and a dog owner. I have lived in Sunbury and walked my dog in Sunbury park almost every day for almost 5 years now and I feel that is a beautiful park that is a treasured place to locals, dog owners and families alike. I have read all of the comments on here so far and understand the concerns of some people but I did think this was meant to be a discussion regarding the introduction of cattle into the park not an all out verbal attack on dog owners..... so Please!!! ....a little manners goes a long way and we are all adults after all and we should be able to discuss many issues that are worrying people in the park in a calm, non abusive manner.
  I too agree there is a big problem with people not picking up their dog's mess in the park but it is a handful of people spoiling it for everyone and believe me we as responsible dog owners are equally frustrated and annoyed about this. I myself have on many occasion called after someone and offered them a pooh bag in case they haven't got one, sometimes I myself have been greeted with moody face , moaned at or been completely ignored so please do not tarnish us all with the same brush.
  I have thought long and hard about the cattle being introduced to Sunbury Park and though it may be a nice addition in some ways but I do sincerely feel it will have more negative affects to the community than good. As a frequent user of the park I know that there is a strong sense of community and it is often a way of catching up with friends in the area and making new ones. We all look out for each other and often in times of need will help each other out even if we have never met before. For example , you may have seen lost dog posters scattered around Sunbury for some time a couple of months before xmas ...I know for a fact that many people especially dog owners were out looking for this dog even people inc myself who had never met the owner... there is a strong sense of community spirit in the park and yes, I'm sure there are a few who can maybe be rude or inconsiderate but you would get that in any place, but on the whole it usually a positive place.
  Brian made a very valid point, and I agree with him totally, there are not many open spaces for us to walk our dogs off lead safely that is not next to a children's play area, livestock or sports grounds ... and when the fishing season arrives it's even harder to walk along the river but that is not an attack on the fishing enthusiast out there but I have often been sworn at by someone telling me I " just disturbed his fish" because my dog had a paddle a few metres away from where he was... not usually something you would hear a dog owner shouting at you just because you are walking through the park without a dog.... so where are we meant to walk if we lose this park???
  Johnny made a suggestion for dog owners to move on and start walking in the park on Green Street....Hmmm .. Johnny do you visit either of these parks? The park on Green St is a lot smaller and actually has a children's play area in it! The volume of users in Sunbury Park if they were to walk there would just not be safe for the dogs or big enough to accommodate that amount of visitors at one time and you will probably find as I have after speaking to many dog owners that we all use Sunbury to respect the fact that there is a children's play area there and that Sunbury Park is far better suited. I for one rarely walk at Green Street for this reason. Some have said the cattle would be a lovely thing for the children to be able to see and yes it would ... so maybe they should suggest the cattle at the park on Green Street instead and the children can watch safely from their play area ...? Just a thought....
  Geoff also made a very good point, there have been many reports of undesirable behaviour going on in the park during the evening and into the night... there have been rumours of people sleeping in the park and using drugs etc ..there recently was evidence of some form of cult goings on of a slightly worrying nature too... this all makes me extremely worried for any livestock's welfare whilst left unattended during the night as I feel they will be extremely vulnerable . Dumsey in my opinion is slightly harder to park up at unnoticed and there are not as many opportunities to stagger straight from the pub and possibly be tempted to attack an animal under the influence of drink or drugs as there is here during the night. ( can you imagine to distress possibly caused after the Sunbury Regatta with all the youngters often heading over there to hang out after drinks etc) and with regards to the dogs at Dumsey , there is a larger space for both to run free and also the distraction of the river for the dogs to play in , which is not possible at Sunbury Park. The fact these cows will be free roaming in all areas of the park means there is no space free for them and us to relax with our dogs. Part of responsible ownership is maintaining our dog's fitness and wellbeing, exercise and socialisation skills, this is how we keep our dogs well balanced, calm , safe and well behaved. My dog is trained , well behaved and socialised with all animals but I think having Cattle free roaming and possibly at least 30 dogs in the park running free playing with other dogs is too risky for both dogs and cattle. I'm sure no matter how well the Cattle or the dogs are adapted to each other if you put them in a small space together especially with lots of dogs playing chase and probably ignoring the cattle it is going to be quite stressful for both animals and I don't think that it is fair to put them in that situation.... Maybe Green Street would be a better option?? Worth considering!
• Comment Link Sunday, 26 January 2014 11:34 posted by Geoff Aylen

  There appears to be one other major issue that has not yet been raised. As a dog owner myself who has walked dogs in the park almost every day for many years, I don't recognise some of the criticisms mentioned. Of course, there are a minority of irresponsible dog walkers, just as there are an irresponsible minority of motorists or even neighbours. Please don't blame the many as a result of the actions of a few. No, the point I wish to make is who is going to protect the cows from the actions of the alcohol fuelled, pill popping yobbish element who regularly party in the park on warm summer evenings (could that be where the foul-mouthed language & behaviour comes from?). Not long ago, my wife and I picked up 14 empty beer cans (yes, sad though we are, we did count them!) aswell as various cigarette packets and food wrappers which had all been discarded around one of the park benches. How long will it be before these partying idiots derive deranged pleasure by attempting, after a few beers, to have their own Wild West rodeo involving the cows? Locally we regularly hear about swans being shot at with pellet guns. Will the cows be next? Who is going to protect the cows after dark from such hooligan behaviour? Rest assured that there will not be anyone employed to be around after dark. As much as the presence of the cows in the Park has its attractions, who would want to be the person to find them in the morning in such a distressed state, after the hooligans have finished. Certainly, not me! No, not a good idea, as far as I can see. On balance, far too risky.
• Comment Link Saturday, 25 January 2014 15:18 posted by Johnny Smith

  Dumsey Meadow by Chertsey Bridge has for many a summer had a grazing herd without any incidents. As there's a public rec further up Green Street the dog walkers could always seek pastures new. Can't rationalise their assumption that this park is somehow their space, its purpose set in stone & any changes repelled.
  I for one would welcome the grazing cattle.
• Comment Link Saturday, 25 January 2014 13:00 posted by Brian

  Sunbury Park is a unique residential green space, it is one of the few safe places where people can exercise their dog freely without the worry of infringing on children's play areas, the fishing community, sports activities and livestock. This is one of the many reasons why so many dog walkers use this park and may seem to some that they view it as their space. It is not just about exercising the dog it's also a great way of keeping in touch with the community,the dog walkers on the whole are a polite sociable lot,who take time to look out for fellow residents.For most dog walkers it means they can walk the dog/s before going to work without having to drive somewhere on the continually increasing congested Sunbury roads.
  A probable reason for the aforementioned pack mentality is the sheer volume of people who use the park to exercise their dog/s there and yes it's the dog owners responsibility to keep their dog under control as the majority do, unfortunately as in all aspects of life there is always the exception that doesn't confirm to what is decent and right.
  It is not only the odd dog walker that acts irresponsibly,there are a number of people who cycle through/around the park who pay scant regard or concern for the safety of those walking,some cyclists do not attempt to slow down or move on approaching. Perhaps those cycling should check out the Bye Laws for the park.
  Cycling
  15. No person shall without reasonable excuse ride a cycle in the ground except
  in any part of the ground where there is a right of way for cycles or on a
  designated route for cycling.
  I am a keen supporter of Bio-diversity especially as the current trend for Spelthorne CC is to replace green space/woodlands with new housing. However,I feel Sunbury Park which is a residential green space used by a great number of people daily is not the best place to introduce cows.
• Comment Link Saturday, 25 January 2014 10:26 posted by Karen

  I too am frustrated by the few dog walkers who either do not clean up after their dogs or show anti social behaviour but please do not tar us all with the same brush. I would 'shop' any dog walker I see not clearing up responsibly and have indeed handed out the odd poo bag. Yes there are a few dog walkers that may well have bad manners but I have worked in education for 20 years and I can say the same for some parents. My dog is an important part of my family and there are very few places in this locality where I can safely walk my dog off lead, that are not designated children's play parks. I really hope my young dog will be able to walk alongside the cows, I am not against biodiversity and the theory behind the cows being in the park but the council have not given me the chance to register my concern in the proper manner. The 'consultation' was not carried out satisfactorily and emails have been frustratingly unanswered.
• Comment Link Friday, 24 January 2014 13:26 posted by Simon

  Dear Justin,
  
  Hear no evil, so no evil eh? I'm sure it's quite a pleasant experience walking through the park if you have a dog with you to ward of other dogs and something to chat to the other owners about. Try walking or cycling through the park with small children and no dog. Just a couple of months ago my 4 year old was skipping through the park and was surrounded by a pack of 3 German shepherds, he started crying and I had rush over and pick him up. When I asked the owners to call the dogs back, two ignored me the other a peroxide woman in her 50's gave me a mouthful of abuse. The year before last my wife was bitten on the ankle by some sort of terrier, again no apology form the owners who seemed more concerned with their dog. I don't own a dog but I have in the past and I would class myself as a dog lover but of all the places I've lived (including some a lot less well to do than Lower Sunbury). Sunbury park unfortunately does have an issue with dog behaviour more than anywhere else. Probably due to the pack mentality of owners and dogs as a result to volume of them and partly due to people treating their dogs like spoilt children. Regarding Dog mess I'm not sure the ratio of non pick uppers is any higher than elsewhere but again due to the numbers I see it about once a month and I walk through the park every few days. Admittedly I usually say something and they usually attempt to pick it up. More commonplace is the quick glance round to see if anyone else has noticed the dog crapping before doing the pick up.
  
  What would be nice is if the dog walking community in the park could do something about those badly behaved dogs and owners amongst their number rather ignoring it or failing to notice.
  
  I welcome the cows if not the bulls.
• Comment Link Friday, 24 January 2014 10:26 posted by Justin Main Thompson

  I read with interest the above remarks in regard to dogs and their owners. Since moving to Sunbury two years ago I have walked my dog on Sunbury Common on a daily basis-sometimes twice a day. I have yet to see a dog owner not pick up dog mess, have never witnessed any children being harassed by dogs and have certainly never witnessed any foul mouthed exchanges. The dog walkers I have encountered have been friendly , cheerful and public spirited. I constantly see dog walkers picking up litter and empty drinks cans and disposing of them in the bins provided. I think the key issue is the lack on consultation over this issue and the failure to follow a democratic process. That is something all should be concerned about- canine lover or otherwise!